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The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?


The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

Rick Helling '96 listed as a SP ? But with 40 Stamina like his imported RP self. What gives ?

https://www.pennantchase.com/lgRost..

Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

Hi Jay, this is actually my roster. Their is an option when selecting a player that allows for these spot Rp Sp to change their roles, I applied it on Helling to switch him to a starter, I discover that feature couple of weeks ago... I don't know when it was implemented, It is available for very few of them in favorite teams league...

Re: Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

Jay - he's right. I tried it with Bunker on an O's team and was able to Change Role - problem is, his Endurance stayed at 40. Opener?

- The Sheik

Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

I was always aware of the Change Role for SP, and their Stamina stayed intact, but the under 85 IP SP was a point of contention. When was this added? It changes my Miami strategy if this is the case. They lose more SP/Openers to the under 85 IP rule than any other franchise.

Re: Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

Have no idea when - I just learned about it too.

Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

I think that might have been an oversight, but I actually see that as an okay compromise... at 40 pitches, the starter without many starts won't be able to go very long in games.

Re: Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

Hmm, that opens up some weird strategies on a couple teams. Mostly its just Tampa in MLB destroying baseball as we know it.

Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

I still don’t get the opener thing. For TB it’s working because the ‘starters’ pitching innings 2-6 are doing well. So unless they have some mental issue with starting a game, they should just be starting. They finally did that with Chirinos.
They should with Beeks and Yarborough too. The only way using an opener makes sense is if the normal starter has some kind of mental block starting a game and does better coming in later. I don’t know that to be true of any pitcher but could be.

Yankees doing it too. Yesterday Chad Green pitched the first then Cortez and Cessa pitched 3. That’s a little different, basically a bullpen game. But this eliminates Green’s usefulness later in a game, or extra innings, because he can pitch 2 or 3 himself. Cortes or Cessna should have just started. Depending on score, maybe Green wouldn’t even be needed. Just seems like a waste of his talent. Maybe a misplaced rant.

Re: Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

It's a strategy thing - start a righty, let him pitch an inning or 2, bring in a lefty. Makes it harder to stack your lineup because you have to anticipate a pitching change.

- The Sheik

Re: Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

I switch Helling to a SP with the intention of keeping him sleeping in the bullpen, and not even use him as the long relief man... I already have anothe SP in the long relief role. I just wan't the Sim to use him in desperate causes only. By having him be a Sp in the pen, the sim will use him in minimal amount of games...

Though about using him as an opener, but I am to gun shy to put the experiment to test...

Main advantage of the opener, is that you avoid the hearth of the lineup getting multiple AB's vs the same pitcher, which tend to advatage the hitter a lot...

Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

For me, I know Ill utilize this at some point w 3 or 4 teams I'm still chasing rings with, here's the advantage. A better pitcher in the first 2-3 innings than you'd get normally. I just tried it out w MIA in a FT-Auto. I have Helling in the rotation, but I also have 5 other viable SP. Have a little bit of bullpen depth and opted to shy away from any terrible defenders. Hopefully it pans out. MIA is the only franchise I've never got to .500 with, and one of only 3 teams Ive never got to the postseason.

Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

Sheik, I agree, righty - lefty switch would be good strategy. Yanks had all righties. Yarborough and Beeks are lefties for the Rays, so if that’s the reason, I’m on board.

Re: Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

Minnesota 1970 has a great potential opener. Just notice Tom Hall is available to role change as a RP to a SP.

55 stamina, 1,03 whip, 5.5 h per 9, 10.5 K per 9.

If a pitcher like that can get a better chunk of innings than any average Joe, or he would even normally get himself being just another reliever, it should be a plus for your team...

maybe the opener era as just began on pennant chase?

Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

I know the discussions started before I got here, but I've been dying to use a staff of maybe 2 or 3 actual SP, with nothing other than 8-9 RP..

I tried with the Rays :

https://www.pennantchase.com/lgRost..
But I've had much more success with a complete team (2007-2009-2015-2018)

I've already got my Texas ring, so I can play around a little:

https://www.pennantchase.com/lgRost..
(67-41) Much more success w some offense behind the pen strategy.

I employ a strong pen whenever my rotation is weak. Its all a numbers game...here's how I see it...
Lets say I have a SP who's 1.05 7.5 H9/8.8 K9..

And my pen is (WHIP/H9/K9) :

RP1 0.79 / 3.9 / 15.1
RP2 0.85 / 4.5 / 13.7
RP3 0.89 / 5.1 / 10.4
RP4 0.91 / 4.9 / 9.8
RP5 0.99 / 5.9 / 10.2
RP6 1.01 / 6.3 / 9.2
RP7 1.05 / 6.8 / 8.4

Why would I not want to maximize the # of innings I have lower H9, more K9 ? Its the same strategy as not pinch-hitting and maximizing AB for my top RK hitters.

So instead of having the conventional:
Innings 1-6: 7.5 H9/8.8 K9
Inning 7: 3.9/15.1
Inning 8: 4.5/13.7
Inning 9: 5.1/10.4

Why would I not prefer :
Innings 1-4: 7.5/8.8
Inning 5: 3.9/15.1
Inning 6: 4.5/13.7
Inning 7: 5.1/10.4
Inning 8: 4.9/9.8
Inning 9: 5.9/10.2

Why would I NOT want my lowest H9, highest K9 for my HIGHEST leveraged innings (6th-9th).. To me, Its the only way that makes sense.

Re: Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

It does make sense, and it is the main reason why we are witnessing such a revolution in MLB right now regarding pitching management...

After all, bullpen have been overlook for years... and then when you look at the most successfull teams in the last couple of decades, from the 80's and beyond... bullpens have won so many championships without getting enough recognition, that we can even start questionning every WAR formula's that would not give relievers enough credit...

I remember the 1996 Wetteland - Mariano Rivera shutdown combo being quite the lights up to me, about bullpen winning championships,

They were only 2 back then... now they can be 4 or 5 of these shutdown relievers in the same team...

I remember in the late 80's and 90's, playing the old strat o matic board game, I would be pounding my all star bullpen, it was quite an unpopular strategy among my pears, but quite an effective one...

It was possible because we were putting together all star lineups...

It should not be any different today, only difference is that pitchers are now build as being relievers right from the start of their career, where before they we underachieving starters who were converted into relievers.... so there is a lot more talents and specificaly formated relievers in todays game to allow this revolution...

Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

Sorry guys but I need to go back to Kindergarten on this topic. Are you all saying that the determining factor that the game uses to determine SP vs RP is 85IP?

Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

For importing players in favorite team leagues that’s the rule.

For PC in general it seems that if the stamina is under 60 they are RP, over is SP. stamina is determine by IP/G or something like that.

Re: Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

Grumpy - it's arbitrary. If I had to guess, Guy thought it sounded about right and made it so. The thinking behind having any cut off is that you don't want some 7 start wonder making 32 starts and being a total game changer.

- The Sheik

Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

That's why I've lobbied for a sliding scale, IP to WHIP based. But Guy thinks it may be complicated for some. While I'm inclined to agree, we're already here crunching baseball statistics/sabermetrics and spending way too much time on bbref.com, so what's the difference? Lol

Re: Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

I'm just looking ahead trying to figure out if I'll have enough starters next year or if I should start trading for one. I have a guy like Manny Parra (42G/16GS/122IP). I wish I could figure out what role he will play next year.

Re: The ol 85 IP SP issue, error ?

2010 Parra imports on PC as an RP with 53 stamina